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The Lord has made it clear how he wants teaching to be conducted in His Church and in our homes. His goal for teacher is that they "understand one another, and both are edified and rejoice together" (Doctrine and Covenants 50:22).

Abstract: One of the important topics of Teaching in the Savior’s Way is orchestrating gospel discussions. As teachers, leading a successful discussion is critical to helping class members “Hear Him.” This article begins by talking about two of President Nelson’s talks that describe how to integrate learning from spiritual and secular sources and show that what is learned from secular sources can inform learning from spiritual ones. Spiritual guidance for orchestrating discussions is provided, which is then augmented by some secular guidance from educational research about orchestrating classroom discussions.

Keywords: Teaching the gospel, revelation, knowledge, truth

Of Kingdoms and Divine Laws: Learning from Spiritual and Secular Sources

While speaking at Brigham Young University,[1] President Russell M. Nelson described the path he followed in learning to become a heart surgeon. In 2015, he said,

In my early days of research into the workings of the human heart, very little was known. There was no field of heart surgery. In fact, we were taught in medical school that one must never touch the beating heart. To do so would cause the heart to stop beating. So little by little we began to tread into uncharted waters. For me, those early exploratory experiments were buttressed by this sure word of the Lord from the Doctrine and Covenants:

All kingdoms have a law given; And there are many kingdoms; for there is no space in the which there is no kingdom; and there is no kingdom in which there is no space, either a greater or a lesser kingdom. And unto every kingdom is given a law; and unto every law there are certain bounds also and conditions. [Doctrine and Covenants 88:36–38]

President Nelson then went on to discuss another scriptural passage that provided similar support for his work as a surgeon.

This knowledge, coupled with one other revelation, provided the undergirding foundation I needed for my work. The other revelation is well known to you:

There is a law, irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all blessings are predicated—and when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated. [Doctrine and Covenants 130:20–21]

He then interwove the two doctrines described in those passages to teach how the laws of God can inform learning in a secular context.

By learning for the kingdom of the heart what laws must be obeyed for the heart to beat, eventually we were able to turn the heartbeat off and turn it on again. This enabled surgery of the heart to be predictable and dependable. Even educated and experienced doctors would wonder, Can you really do that?

The answer is simply this: When the laws of God are obeyed, wanted blessings will always result, not just maybe or sometimes. Divine law is dependable! Divine law is incontrovertible![2]

There are a few points President Nelson made that provide the framework for this article.

• He applied the word kingdom to the circulatory system—“the kingdom of the heart.”
• He said that associated with that kingdom are laws that must be obeyed if we are to have success in navigating within those kingdoms.
• The scriptures, meaning truths from a spiritual source, provided him with buttressing and an undergirding foundation for his “early exploratory experiments” in the secular work of heart surgery.

Now, what didn’t President Nelson say? He did not say he learned everything about the kingdom of the heart from the scriptures, a spiritual source of knowledge. Indeed, he learned a great deal about that kingdom from secular sources, such as medical school, residencies, fellowships, and his own research. Thus the knowledge from a spiritual source provided him a framework within which he could acquire knowledge from secular sources. Indeed, knowledge from secular sources informed his understanding and use of knowledge from spiritual sources.

If there is a kingdom of the heart associated with the workings of the circulatory system, there must also be a kingdom of learning associated with the workings of the brain. And just as there are laws that must be obeyed for the heart to beat and circulate blood, there are laws that must be obeyed for learning to take place. Indeed, success in heart surgery is guaranteed if the laws that govern the workings of heart are obeyed, and therefore, success in teaching is guaranteed if the laws of learning are obeyed. Those laws can be learned from both spiritual sources and secular sources, and the laws from spiritual sources can provide a framework within which laws from secular sources are learned. Put in another way, the explication of the divine laws of learning provided by secular sources can help to illuminate elements of those same laws which are learned from spiritual sources. God is the ultimate source of all that is good and true.

Orchestrating Discussions

The recently published Church manual Teaching in the Savior’s Way[3] provides a marvelous compilation of divine laws regarding teaching and learning. Among other laws, it quotes Doctrine and Covenants 88 in recommending a more involved pattern of social interaction among teachers and students than the traditional one-way method of dispensing information: “Teach one another. . . . Let not all be spokesmen at once; but let one speak at a time and let all listen unto his sayings, that when all have spoken that all may be edified of all, and that every man may have an equal privilege” (vv. 77, 122). This revelation directs that gospel teachers make use of discussions that invite all class members to participate, and Teaching in the Savior’s Way adds: “When the Savior taught, He did more than just share information. He gave His disciples opportunities to ask questions and share their testimonies. . . . As a teacher, you can encourage uplifting discussions enriched by learners’ experiences and testimonies. Even small children often have much to contribute.”[4] The manual goes on to suggest that teachers should “share the stage,” so to speak: “In many cases, it may be appropriate to invite learners to help each other find answers to their questions. When prompted by the Spirit, you may decide to do this even if you feel that you know the answer. . . .You may find that the questions and insights that invite the Spirit come just as often from a diligent learner as from the teacher.”[5] In other words, the Lord promises revelation when our students learn to learn from each other.

Metaphorically speaking, it might be useful to compare the leading of a discussion to the work of an orchestra conductor. Although she or he is no doubt quite able to play any number of musical instruments, the conductor chooses to forego contributing to a performance by doing so. Rather, the conductor directs the performance of all the players in an effort to create a harmonious synthesis of each player’s contribution. Likewise, a discussion orchestrator strategically and purposefully utilizes the potential contribution of each class member, resulting in such a unity among those members that the Spirit of the Lord cannot be restrained. When Saints “unite their hearts” (see Doctrine and Covenants 84:1) in joint “hungering and thirsting after righteousness” (see 3 Nephi 12:6), revelation can result.

Using a Secular Source to Enhance Discussion Orchestration in Gospel Classrooms

Building on the idea that teachers of spiritual truths can improve their teaching by learning from well-researched principles from secular sources, I will now share a widely accepted, five-step process from mathematics teacher education circles designed to help teachers learn to orchestrate engaging discussions—that is, discussions that encourage students to learn from each other. The process was first published in a mathematics education research journal in 2008 under the title “Orchestrating Productive Mathematical Discussions: Five Practices for Helping Teachers Move Beyond Show and Tell”[6] and then appeared in an article for practicing teachers[7] and a very popular book.[8] Studies have shown the wise use of such practices enhances student learning.[9] I share the five practices in my professional development work in the BYU–Public School Partnership with teachers who are currently teaching elementary mathematics and in my teacher preparation work with BYU students who are learning how to teach mathematics. The teachers who use it in their mathematics teaching consistently report that they make use of it while teaching other subjects as well, and some who are Latter-day Saints say they use the process in their teaching in the Church. I will adapt the description of these five practices to gospel-teaching settings.

1. Knowing our students and their situations well enough that we can begin to anticipate some of their responses to thought-provoking questions
2. Monitoring students’ thoughts on and engagement with a question
3. Selecting specific students to share their responses to the question
4. Sequencing the student responses that will be shared in a specific order
5. Connecting different students’ responses and connecting the responses to key doctrines and historical events

Teaching in the Savior’s Way has some good counsel about each of these practices. Let’s examine what it has to say as we imagine a teacher who is going to teach a lesson about the Prophet Joseph Smith’s First Vision.

1. Knowing our students and their situations well enough that we can begin to anticipate some of their responses to thought-provoking questions

The 2022 edition of the Teaching in the Savior’s Way manual[10] suggests that teachers should “ask questions that encourage learners to find answers in God’s word”[11] and later references the experience of the brother of Jared when he wanted to provide light for the barges he was directed to build. Although he had done so previously, the Lord did not in this instance tell the brother of Jared what to do. Instead he asked, “What will ye that I should do that ye may have light in your vessels? . . . What will ye that I should prepare for you that ye may have light when ye are swallowed up in the depths of the sea?” (Ether 2:23, 25). In the case of the brother of Jared, one thought-provoking question led to one of the greatest revelations ever revealed.

The manual then states: “It might seem easier to just tell learners all the things you think they should know.”[12] In other words, you might be tempted simply to lecture to your students rather than ask good questions. However, the manual then quotes Elder Bednar in this regard: “Our intent ought not to be ‘What do I tell them?’ Instead, the questions to ask ourselves are ‘What can I invite them to do? What inspired questions can I ask that, if they are willing to respond, will begin to invite the Holy Ghost into their lives?’”[13]

There is a divine source that can enable a teacher in the Church to come to know the students and their concerns and then use that knowledge to orchestrate meaningful discussions around good questions. Teaching in the Savior’s Way suggests “seek to know [your students]—understand their circumstances, needs, and strengths. Pray for them by name.”[14]

The manual further highlights this principle:

Being a Christlike teacher includes getting to know the people you teach and striving to understand what is in their hearts. You can take an interest in their lives and show compassion. You can look for ways to understand their backgrounds, talents, interests, and needs. You can find out how they learn best. You can ask questions, listen carefully, and observe. Above all, you can pray for the understanding that only the Spirit can give. The better you know a person, the better able you are to help him or her find personal meaning and power in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Once you understand a person’s thirst, the Spirit can teach you how to help quench it with the Savior’s living water.[15]

As you seek to come to know your students, try to consider different ways your students might respond to your thought-provoking questions. In doing so, you will be following the Lord’s direction to Oliver Cowdery to “study it out in your mind” (Doctrine and Covenants 9:8) before seeking the divine direction you need.

Perhaps our imaginary teacher poses this one thought-provoking question to commence the discussion orchestration process: What lessons can we learn from the Prophet Joseph Smith’s First Vision experience regarding seeking and receiving guidance from the Lord? She predicts one student might be impressed with the length of time Joseph sought for truth, another student could note that Joseph’s search was empowered by the spiritual experience he had reading James 1:5, and that another student may observe that Joseph must have been prayerful during his search because the Sacred Grove was the first time he had ever uttered an audible prayer—suggesting he had consistently engaged in silent prayer. She can listen for those thoughts being expressed in the next steps in the process.

2. Monitoring students’ thoughts on and engagement with a question

Deep thinking, inspired of the Holy Ghost, is not the result of quick-fire question and answer sequences. If teachers want their students to think deeply about a question and experience the guidance of the Spirit in their thinking, they should “provide time for all learners to ponder a question before asking them to share answers.”[16] Most students are so accustomed to teachers expecting immediate answers that a teacher might actually have to say to them something like “I am going to ask a question and I want to give you a moment to think about it before we share our thoughts.”

In order to give students a chance to go deeper with their thoughts, prepare themselves to share those thoughts later with the whole class, and in the process give the teacher a chance to assess what the students are thinking, teachers should “consider dividing learners into small discussion groups, as appropriate.”[17] This is the teacher’s chance to walk around and listen in. For example, suppose our imaginary teacher gave her class a moment to ponder the question about the First Vision. She then organizes the students into groups of three or four, asks them to share their thoughts with each other about the question, and then gives them another moment to get their conversations going. At that point she walks around listening for the responses she thought some of her students might say, as well other meaningful responses. Suppose she listens in on one group and a student says, “I think it’s really interesting that Joseph actually spent two years searching and pondering over the question of his situation before God and which Church was right.” The teacher says, “I have had that same thought. It sort of blows my mind that a twelve-year-old kid would take a question like that so seriously, seriously enough to spend two years of his life pondering it. Why do you suppose Joseph had the tenacity to spend two years of his life engaged in this search?” Teaching in the Savior’s Way calls this later question a “follow-up question” that “encourage[s] learners to think [even] more deeply about gospel principles.”[18]

3. Selecting specific students to share their responses to the question

This is a fairly simple step in the orchestration process. When the teacher hears a response that she thought might come out, or when someone says something else that she feels impressed to have shared because it meets the goals for that class period, she should ask that student if she or he would mind to sharing it with the whole class. So, in the above scenario, if the imaginary teacher hears “I think it’s really interesting that Joseph actually spent two years searching and pondering over the question of his situation before God and which Church was right,” she asks the student if she would be willing to share it. It’s also important to note that teachers don’t need to worry about having members of every small group share their responses, especially in larger classes. There probably isn’t time, and besides, the students benefitted from sharing in a small group.

4. Sequencing the student responses that will be shared in a specific order

While students share their thoughts with you in their small group discussions, determine in which order to address them in the whole class discussion based on the needs of the students and the substance of the material being discussed. Recall that our imaginary teacher anticipated that one student would be impressed with the length of time Joseph sought for truth. She anticipated another student would note that Joseph’s search was empowered by the spiritual experience she had reading James 1:5, and that a third student would observe that Joseph must have been prayerful during his search because the Sacred Grove was the first time he had ever uttered an audible prayer—suggesting he had consistently engaged in silent prayer. She conjectures that all three thoughts were powerful components of the Savior’s direction to ask, seek, and knock. When she hears all three responses, she chooses to share them in such a way that each response builds on the previous one. It makes sense to her that first a person who is trying to find God needs to have a fixed determination, then that person ought to be prayerful in that search, and that he ought to study the scriptures for additional guidance, so she has the responses shared in that order.

5. Connecting different students’ responses and connecting the responses to key doctrines and historical events

The Teaching in the Savior’s Way manual provides some very powerful principles to ensure that, as we say in mathematics education, the discussion you orchestrate is not just a “show and tell” free-for-all where all we want to do is make everybody feel good. That is, the discussion should make the students who share feel good about themselves, but the discussion is where most of the learning takes place. That’s why the Lord said, “Let not all be spokesmen at once; but let one speak at a time and let all listen unto his sayings, that when all have spoken that all may be edified of all” (Doctrine and Covenants 88:122). Teaching in the Savior’s Way says:

The Lord wants all of us—not just His prophets—to have the power to speak His word. He wants that for all of us, including for the people you teach (see Doctrine and Covenants 1:20–21). Our words may not move mountains or redirect rivers, but they can help change hearts. That is why it is so important to give learners opportunities to share with each other what they are learning about the Savior and His gospel. Doing this will help them internalize the truths they are taught and express them. It will also help them gain confidence in their ability to share truths in other settings.[19]

Similarly, in the earlier version of the manual:

Everyone has something to contribute, but sometimes not everyone gets a chance. Christlike teachers are interested in the learning of each person, not just the outspoken ones. Look for ways to increase the number of class members who can share their testimonies.[20]

Here is some advice from a secular source about helping students make connections.[21] Rather than assume students will listen to the sharing of responses by their peers, it is important to plan ways to promote a “more active role from students as listeners as well as explainers. . . . Heightened [encouragement] for participation creates conditions in which the students who [are] listening [are] expected to be increasingly involved in the examination of the thinking of the student giving an explanation.”[22] This statement suggests that after the teacher has determined what students will share and in what order, she should tell the rest of the class what to listen for and call on those students to respond during and after each sharing. Such listening “jobs” include inviting the listening students to restate what they just heard a fellow student say, adding on to what they heard, comparing what they were thinking to what their classmates said, comparing or looking for patterns in different things their classmates said, transferring what they heard to a new context, or offering an alternative viewpoint to what they heard. This guidance helps teachers follow specific directions in Teaching in the Savior’s Way: “Resist the tendency to answer every question. Involve others in seeking answers. . . . Before sharing your insights about a scripture, ask learners to share their own. . . . Express clear expectations to help learners grow.”[23]

Our hypothetical teacher decides that she is going to ask her students to assume two listening jobs from the list provided above—listen to determine if the thoughts being shared connect with theirs and listen to see if they can add on to what is being shared. She tells her students this at the beginning of the discussion, then after the first student talks about the length of time Joseph was seeking, she asks the whole class to show by the raising of hands if they had a similar thought. Then she asks if anyone would like to add on. As her teaching continues through the weeks and months, her students become accustomed to these listening jobs, and she sometimes calls on them without them raising their hands. And eventually, this teacher’s students engage in these listening jobs without her even inviting them to do so.

Conclusion

The Lord has made it very clear how he wants teaching to be conducted in his Church and in our homes. His goal for teacher and student is that they “understand one another, and both are edified and rejoice together” (Doctrine and Covenants 50:22). He has also revealed that teaching should involve the participation of all students in sharing thoughts, insights, and testimonies, and that special revelatory blessings will only be given if such participation is allowed, invited, and directed by an inspired teacher. I believe and testify that “a true gospel teacher is not satisfied when learners simply listen to what he or she has to say. Learning the gospel is not meant to be a passive experience.”[24]

The Lord said, “Whatsoever ye shall ask in faith, being united in prayer according to my command, ye shall receive” (Doctrine and Covenants 29:6). Providing for participation in ways the Lord has outlined creates a very powerful, united learning community of Saints. Elder Bednar went on to say, “As all speak and as all listen in a dignified and orderly way, all are edified. The individual and collective exercise of faith in the Savior invites instruction and strength from the Spirit of the Lord.”[25] Indeed, teacher and student will “receive revelation upon revelation, knowledge upon knowledge, that [they may] know the mysteries and peaceable things—that which bringeth joy, that which bringeth life eternal” (Doctrine and Covenants 42:61). If they are given the chance to express their “hunger[ing] and thirst[ing] after righteousness” in the Savior’s way, “they shall be filled with the Holy Ghost” (3 Nephi 12:6).

Notes

[1] Russell M. Nelson, “The Tie between Science and Religion” (Brigham Young University devotional, April 9, 2015), https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/russell-m-nelson/the-tie-between-science-and-religion/; see also Nelson, “The Love and Laws of God” (Brigham Young University devotional, September 17, 2019), https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/russell-m-nelson/love-laws-god/.

[2] Nelson, “Tie between Science and Religion.”

[3] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (Salt Lake City: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 2016).

[4] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2016), 33.

[5] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2016), 24, 29.

[6] Mary Kay Stein, Randi A. Engle, Margaret S. Smith, and Elizabeth K. Hughes, “Orchestrating Productive Mathematical Discussions: Five Practices for Helping Teachers Move Beyond Show and Tell,” Mathematical Thinking and Learning 10, no. 4 (2008): 313–40, https://doi.org/10.1080/10986060802229675.

[7] Margaret S. Smith, Elizabeth K. Hughes, Randi A. Engle, and Mary Kay Stein, “Orchestrating Discussions,” Mathematics Teaching in the Middle School 14, no. 9 (2009): 548–56, https://doi.org/10.5951/MTMS.14.9.0548.

[8] Margaret S. Smith and Mary Kay Stein, 5 Practices for Orchestrating Productive Mathematics Discussions (Reston, VA: National Council of Teachers of Mathematics, 2011).

[9] See Suzanne H. Chapin, Catherine O’Connor, and Nancy Canavan Anderson, Classroom Discussions: Using Math Talk to Help Students Learn (Sausalito, CA: Math Solutions Publications, 2003).

[10] Teaching in the Savior’s Way: For All Who Teach in the Home and in the Church (Salt Lake City: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 2022).

[11] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 27.

[12] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 25.

[13] David A. Bednar, “Evening with a General Authority” (worldwide Church broadcast, February 7, 2020), https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/broadcasts/an-evening-with-the-general-authorities/2020/02/bednar-highlights, quoted in Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 25.

[14] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 3.

[15] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 13.

[16] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 27.

[17] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 27.

[18] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2016), 34.

[19] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 26.

[20] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2016), 33.

[21] For more informative advice on these general principles from a secular standpoint, see Damon L. Bahr and Kim Bahr, “Engaging All Students in Mathematical Discussions,”

Teaching Children Mathematics 23, no. 6 (2017): 351–59.

[22] Terry Wood and Tammy Turner-Vorbeck, “Extending the Conception of Mathematics Teaching,” in Beyond Classical Pedagogy: Teaching Elementary School Mathematics, ed. Terry Wood, Barbara Scott Nelson, and Janet Warfield (Mahwah, NJ: Erlbaum, 2001), 192; emphasis added.

[23] Teaching in the Savior’s Way (2022), 27.

[24] Teaching in the Savior's Way (2016), 29; see also Damon L. Bahr, “Teaching in the Savior’s Way: True Principles in Both Spiritual and Secular Learning,” Religious Educator 21, no. 1 (2020): 156.

[25] Bednar, “Seek Learning by Faith,” in The Voice of My Servants: Apostolic Messages on Teaching, Learning, and Scripture, ed. Scott C. Esplin and Richard Neitzel Holzapfel (Provo, UT: Religious Studies Center, Brigham Young University; Salt Lake City: Deseret Book, 2010), 175.